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  • Cops VS Crims Gameplay Topic


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    I see a lot of comments about what's "realistic" but I think the best roleplay comes from ridiculous scenarios which occur in ways that could never be mimicked IRL. For example, I think the server could benefit massively by buffing the damage cars take before they're disabled. This would provide longer pursuits and open up the ability to do unique jumps or maneuvers. It's not realistic, but it's fun and I think that's what we're all here for anyways. GTA was never meant to be a realistic platform, but it's full of mechanics that add a ton of potential for interesting scenarios if we take advantage of them. 

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    It's time we had this discussion as a community, Cops VS Crims Gameplay. SHARE YOUR EXPERIENCES/OPINIONS. Please keep comments tactful and do not curse or attack anyone sharing their input, or select

    So some things you mentioned in this post we can all agree can be re-worked or changed.   But unless your pablo escabar you will always be at somewhat of a disadvantage to police. Crims

    "National standards say it should be done at 35mph. This being a game, i think 60-70mph is acceptable imo. Let the RP play out instead of always trying to end it right away" Pits are only approve

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    Hey everyone, I am Jack Simmons, one of the Assistant Chiefs of the NYPD. I have been in the community for a year and a half, and a cop for just as long. I also have been a supervisor for almost exactly one year. I am going to attempt to address your concerns with answers, solutions (that both, civ and cops will have to work towards), and of course explanations and fact and opinion because some of your information seems ill informed. I am going to address each of your talking points separately and they will be divided by quotes.

     

    I would to start out by saying this has taken me 2 hours to type. And I might be unknowingly repeating what others have already said, I apologize.

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    It is the most important white list job on the server. Law enforcement ensures we have an active, vibrant, city on all servers, whether you agree or not. Without them, there is not many things for crims to do. We need them! Especially since 70% of the players are criminals on the servers.  

     

    I agree it is the most important job, period, on the server. It is absolutely imperative to have cops, however it is also imperative to have criminals and civilians. It is a necessary balance, you cannot have one without the other, and vise versa.

     

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    After all, this is GTA.

     

    No, this is FiveM Roleplay.

     

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    They are held to higher standard than the civs because they are an official organization that maintains law and order on all servers.

     

    Yes, they are held to a higher standard, I don't think anyone disagrees with that. However as a community we should all be held at a high standard.

     

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    They are trained to execute several of complex tasks and maintain professionalism for a variety of scenarios.

     

    You're correct, myself, and many other supervisors once had to go through these trainings, we now dictate how those trainings are developed and trained. Trust me when I say, I and many others have spent an innumerable amount of time devising trainings and improving not only our subordinates, but our selves as well.

     

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    They are the backbone to the community. Unfortunately, not everyone is cut out to be a cop.  

     

    I disagree, as I previously stated it is a balance. Everyone, including civilians (crims or otherwise) make up this community, thus making the backbone as well. To a certain extent I agree, that not everyone is cut out to be a cop. But that's why we have an in character academy; to not only teach cadets how to be a cop and roleplay as one. We train them relentlessly.

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    We have come to a point where many, but not all, cops will do whatever it takes to win the scenario at hand with unfair gameplay and who are quick to end the role play scenario.

     

    Surely. But the same thing can be said about many (but not all) criminals as well. It is a two way street. I myself, as well as many other long time cops have experienced W Criminals. I have been rammed out of pursuits. I have had 7 criminals with automatics shoot me at a traffic stop because I mentioned I smelled marijuana. I have had people get away using stunt jumps, I have had people break many server rules. I could go on, and yes I have reported these people, but what about the ones that I don't get ID's for? Nonetheless I digress, the very simple answer here is, as previously stated, its a two way street, and its not fair to put cops or criminals in that category as a group. We have an issue with "W Players" that do not belong to a specific organization or classification with-in our community. If they play their cop for the w, they surely would play their criminal for the w.

     

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    I understand that on a 32 slot server, there are only 7 cops allowed to be on duty. This means that they have to keep law and order for 25 players. On a 64 slot server, I believe its 14 cops allowed to be on duty to keep law and order for 50 players.

     

    Let me clarify that in:

    32 Slot Servers, there can be a max of 10 officers; 7 of this ten are SOLO CERTIFIED OFFICERS (Probationary +), 3 of the 10 are Cadets.

     

    64 Slot Servers, there can be a max of 17 officers; 14 of this 17 are SOLO CERTIFIED OFFICERS (Probationary +), 3 of this 17 are Cadets.

     

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    Unless the city is CODE RED.

     

    In a code red city:

     

    32 Slot Servers can have an additional 4 Emergency Response Units.

     

    64 Slot Servers can have an additional 4 Emergency Response Units. (Formerly ERT/SORT)

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    # of Units in Chase: Cops say its 4 units max in a chase, not counting AIR 1. However, many times this is not the case, with more than 4 units joining in the chase, with cops trying to pass up other cops to capture the suspect. And when a crime is committed, often the whole police force is on it, even if it is just one person who committed the crime such as a chase, store robbery, jewelry store robbery. Makes no sense to have all these units on one vehicle when there is a city full of criminal activity.

      **Solution: Train law enforcement and enforce standards with strikes. Police up the madness.

     

    I can say that without a doubt we do enforce this rule, sometimes mistakes happen. A supervisor should be supervising the pursuit and confirming who is in the pursuit. Sometimes there is no supervisor on duty. When this happens, it falls on the officers to handle that, normally the highest ranking. No amount of training will change this, it is already a standard, and is already written in the "Standard Operating Procedure". We do not announce when we discipline someone and we never will, but trust, that strikes are employed when necessary.

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    AIR 1: Way too over powered. Ability to lock onto players driving with the ability to use infrared to track players vehicle transmitting heat, however not locals. Once locked on, pilot can just fly around without having to use any visual skill set. Pilots use it to see thru buildings and concrete structures. Used to land and engage players with units already on ground. Flies around the area even while being shot at, and near impossible to shoot it down for those pilots who fail to value their life. Lastly, does not count against the number of units in chase, even though it is the most effective to communicate with ground units. Its proven pilots can not handle the responsibility of when to use infrared and lock on even though they are trained.

      **Solution: Remove infrared and lock on ability. Let pilots actually learn and use visual skill sets in game to communicate to ground units. Should count as a unit in chase. Should be able to be shot down. 

     

    Where do I even start with the helicopter? Alright so, I disagree that is overpowered. If it is abused, it is. If used correctly, it is not.

     

    You have to realize that there is only one pilot and no co-pilot. A CoPilot normally operates the camera while the other one flies. It would be impossible to operate that helicopter and use the camera.

     

    Police helicopters have infrared. And the one in the city does track signatures from players and locals alike.

     

    If pilots are using it to powergame (Looking through walls and using that info/not unlocking when suspects go out of view, IE: Behind buildings, under bridges, underground), ban them, ban them immediately, they will have their cert removed and they will be striked, I can 100% guarantee that, it is in direct violation of our operating procedures.

     

    AIR 1 Pilots should not be landing to engage whatsoever, PLEASE, IF THIS HAPPENS TO YOU, FILE AN IN CHARACTER COMPLAINT.

     

    Yeah, just get higher elevation and employ tactical maneuvers and you aren't gonna hit the pilot or even the helicopter most of the time.

     

    Its a helicopter, its not meant to fall out of the sky.

     

    No, if they can't land and engage, they do not count as a unit in the pursuit.

     

    TL:DR: Keep infrared and lock on ability, pilots are trained vigorously on visual skills WHILE piloting and they do communicate to ground units. Its easy to escape the helicopter, just go for the tunnels.

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    Pitting: Have no clue on what the standard is for a pit maneuver, however, when pitting is done, almost all do not value the life of players in the vehicle. I assume law enforcement is trained not to pit in excess speeds over 100mph.  Not Valuing Life (NVL) is a rule violation even if you are a cop. I have seen and been pitted at speeds over 110mph several of times. National standards say it should be done at 35mph. This being a game, i think 60-70mph is acceptable imo. Let the RP play out instead of always trying to end it right away.

     

    **Solution: Train law enforcement and enforce standards. Implement top speed a pit maneuver can be executed. Players report to team speak with video clip when a NVL/RDM pit is executed for staff to review and take action. This should not be a strike for officer involved in NVL/RDM Pit. It is a BCRP rule violation.


    OUR standard procedures for pit maneuvers are the following:

     

    Pits are last resorts in a pursuit, just like AR is last resort in a shoot out. A pit is preformed when you have commited specific crimes, such as attempted murder on leo or otherwise. A pit, is considered lethal force, meaning, that the officer performing the pit could very well kill the person inside. There is no speed cap on pits, because you find me ONE road legal, motorized vehicle that does not go 100 MPH. NVL is a rule for every player in this community. National standards do not mean anything in our city. It is a game, and if you want to be realistic about all this, sure lets do that, nerf ALL cars to their realistic values, wipe the economy and employ realistic prices. "Let the RP play out", the great thing about our server is roleplay here is always evolving, even while the roleplay is taking place. Roleplay, will not always have the end result you expected, or wanted.

     

    https://clips.twitch.tv/TenderCrazyChimpanzeeGOWSkull

     

    As far as the clip is concerned the way the pit was done is correct, however I have no context on the situation that happened prior to it. If you believe that is was done wrong in the moment, why was no in character complaint filed so it could be investigated and dealt with? Us supervisors cannot watch streams and take what we see and discipline officers. ALL COMPLAINTS MUST BE MADE IN CHARACTER. 

     

    Once again we have standards and they are enforced. Our standards are created around the server rules and they are approved by Senior Management. I am sure you have been directly involved in some of our additions as a management member yourself. Implementing a top speed that a pit can be executed at would literally be futile and we might as well make a standard stating that pits should never be executed. The way we combat officers using this in every pursuit is it is considered lethal force and it is not to be done when not approved or necessary. It is not NVL and its not RDM. Sorry, cops risk their lives every day, and pits are apart of their training, and if they fail to follow procedure they are dealt with via NYPD Staff. In the instance that it is NVL and it is RDM, as aforementioned ban them, and if you were involved in that incident in character, submit a complaint so they can be dealt with on our end.

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    Ramming: Ramming continues to occur in police chases to disable criminal vehicles. Again, this is NVL. I understand DSYNC occurs, however, officers use this excuse every time they ram vehicles or say not in my eyes. Its easy enough to use this excuse when you are not streaming or have any video evidence to confirm that as fact. If a players does it to law enforcement to try and disable their vehicle, they get kicked or banned for VDM/NVL. Again this is a BCRP rule violation VDM/NVL. Again, let the RP play out instead of always trying to end it right away.

      **Solution: Train law enforcement to value human life. Players report VDM/NVL to team speak with video clip for staff to review and take action.

     

    This differs majorly from pits, they are complete opposites. And I 100% agree, they need to be banned. And if civs do it to cops they need to be banned. However I disagree, a majority of our force do value human life.

     

    https://www.twitch.tv/zer0cool0tv/clip/MuddyPolishedHeronPeanutButterJellyTime

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    -K9: Way too over powered. Takes 7-10 shots to take a suspect down, takes 2 bites from a K9 to do same thing, while not allowing the suspect to do anything because of how game mechanics work. Many players complain about K9 scent, however its fine the way it is imo if solution is executed. 

      **Solution: Nerf K9 damage to be more realistic with the ability for a suspect to take action.


    This topic kinda relates to Air 1. So a lot of what I am about to say is going to mimic what said about the helicopter.

     

    There is A LOT a K9 handler has to do in each scenario. They have to give verbal commands to the dog, they have to hit a key bind. If you want realism, this is realistic.


    According to my research, a german shepard has a bite force of about 238 PSI (pounds per square inch) which is enough to break bone. And it states that many criminals will give up rather than risk being bitten. That does not happen here, I haven't had it happen. That's not valuing your life.

     

    Furthermore, dogs, like many other living things with teeth, have something called Canine Teeth (AKA Fangs)

    German Shepherd Teething Guide: Stages, When It Stops & Managing ...

     

    The purpose of these teeth?

    These teeth are used for tearing food such as meat apart. They are also used to lock on to an item a dog may have in its mouth, such as a bone or chew toy.

     

    https://www.anythinggermanshepherd.com/how-hard-does-a-german-shepherd-bite/

    https://www.purina.co.uk/dentalife/dental-advice/dog/article/canine-dental-anatomy

     

    Most of the time, the dog is rarely used. Shooting from criminals starts 99% of the time before a K9 is even deployed, even before the officers are out of their vehicles. The K9s are fine, if used correctly they are not overpowered. If used incorrectly can be powergaming, if an officer is caught powergaming, ban them.

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    Police Vehicle Durability: Cop car durability is way over powered. They hardly ever break down, regardless of what they hit. And all cops know this and do wreckless driving. Why they use to ram vehicles, etc. I get it, law enforcement vehicles have some armor, bumper guards, and off the market hardware. While civilian vehicles break or engines get redlined quickly.  

      **Solution: Make the durability more realistic and Nerf durability.

     

    Clips of me eating shit and vehicle getting disabled.

    https://www.twitch.tv/zer0cool0tv/clip/ThoughtfulColorfulShingleCurseLit

    https://www.twitch.tv/zer0cool0tv/clip/PrettyIntelligentPenguinDoritosChip

    https://www.twitch.tv/zer0cool0tv/clip/BovineScaryClintPeteZaroll

    https://www.twitch.tv/zer0cool0tv/clip/RockyBoldCamelCharlieBitMe

     

    This is just a few, of the very many crashes/accidents that I have had happen to me, every single one of these resulted in vehicle being completely disabled.  Our cars disable sometimes if you hit a trash can or pole at 10 mile per hour. From my experience this is no different than a lot of the civ cars. I have seen civ cars survive a lot worse than the clips above. Its a matter of perspective, what they hit, where they hit it, how they hit it etc. If adjustments need to be made, they need to be made on both Civilian and Cop vehicles.

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    Spike Strips: Law enforcement deploying spike strips unfairly to disable vehicles. They will park their car hidden, sometimes even impound their vehicle and walk up to the road making it difficult for the player driving to see them while speeding to deploy spike strips. Spike strips weigh 9lbs. Police officers do not carry these in inventory. They are pulled from a vehicle and laid down. Again, NVL comes into play at high rates of speed with most cars flipping the air and the passengers end up in ER.  

      **Solution: 1. Train law enforcement to execute properly with vehicle next to deployment area and enforce standards. 2. Change coding where car does not flip thru air at high rates of speed when they hit them. or 3. Remove them from game. 4. Players report officers with video clip who abuse the standard for power gaming to team speak for an admin to review and take action.

     

    Spike Strips don't disable vehicles, it pops tires. They can hide their car, but they should not be impounding them, if that happens, ban them. But outsmarting can be deceived as unfair to the person being outsmarted. We aren't going to put up a billboard over our cruiser and point at the spikes on the ground for you. They are on average 9 pounds and can be carried to a location from the car. In my opinion, if you are predictable enough to be spiked, you deserved it. I very rarely see spikes being used, and when I do they are being used correctly. Policy on spikes states 150MPH max unless lethal force is authorized.

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    CDS/Wreckless/Shots Fired Reports: All over powered and unrealistic. Metagaming at its finest.  

      **Solution: Remove notice alerts. This will make cops patrol more and learn new skill sets in game. 

     

    No, they are absolutely needed, what you are implying here (in my opinion), is just W for the criminals. From my experience, it does not report the exact location of the crime anyways. Roleplaying is about interaction, and what you are suggesting removes a lot of interaction.

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    -Filing Police Complaint: Crims get reported for unfair gameplay and get kicked or banned, while it's not the same standard for law enforcement. They get away with quite a bit because they are "TRAINED" to execute tasks and players are told to put in a complaint thru the forum for the officer to get a potential strike. Of course the process to put in a complain in character is severely flawed. Takes a bunch of knowledge to fill out the form, most of the time players do not have, and has to be done in character. Meaning you cant provide video clips to show exactly what happened, etc. Then if a complaint is submitted, no one knows if it ever gets investigated accordingly, as they see the same cops on duty, doing the same thing.  

     

      **Solution: Players should be able to file an official complaint in character while in game with the most senior officer on duty on that server. This would allow the senior officer to gather all the facts from both parties involved and submit to the chain of command for review. This eliminates the need to investigate, and prompt action to be taken/not taken. It only makes sense because this is an role play server. We should not be using a forum form out of game to file complaints which occur in game, if we want players to stay in character. In addition, players need to report cops who break BCRP rule violations in team speak with video evidence for staff to review and take action.

     

    Cops should be reported for unfair gameplay and get kicked/banned too, it should be no different. Our complaint system should be used when someone thinks a cop breaks their standard procedures. Example being not giving them time to have an attorney join them for their processing. It is pretty self explanatory how to fill out the complaint form, there are questions and textboxes for the answer to those questions. If they can fill out a Civ tag application I don't see how filling out a complaint is any difference, at least in the process. And you can provide video evidence, so long as a cops vehicle is facing you or the action you are reporting as all of our cruisers are outfitting with cameras. This way we can receive in character complaints. So your clip of you getting pitted would be valid and considered in character. This was discussed awhile ago by high command and SMT and this is the agreement we came to. Unless this has changed this is still relevant. Your solution is incredibly flawed, what if the most senior officer on duty is a probationary officer? I personally don't trust them to be able to transmit that information accurately to a supervisor to be dealt with. But then lets talk about all of the other stuff that happens in character but is recorded on the forums. Such as; Civil Suits, Docket info, Sales of cars, sales of property, job ads, search warrants. In order to do any of those, including police complaints, we would need a IN CITY way to record it, we have a tablet, could the devs implement feature/ buttons onto the tablet that allows them to be filled/listed/recorded in character and in the city so they would not need to exit the city? That is the only solution I can see here.

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    I cannot do a TLDR because the TLDR would need a TLDR. I really hope that everyone reading this takes the time to read what I have written here, because a lot of the info you are giving is from an outside prospective or opinion. I respect your opinion just like I respect everyone elses here. I hope I answered each talking point you pointed out, and that it comes off as respectful. This is not a Cop V Crim this is a community discussion, based on opinion, different prospective, and some facts. A lot of what you said is true, but its not specific to just cops. Two way street we walk here lets walk it together and fix the community as a whole and not categorize people for what they prefer to roleplay as.

     

    If I was unclear in any of my responses, please do ask questions and I will reply as soon as possible.

     

    If anyone has any questions that are unrelated to any of the talking points, please do ask.

     

     

    PS: Here are some really good roleplay interactions I have caught on stream.

    https://www.twitch.tv/videos/609823295

    https://www.twitch.tv/videos/505855829

    https://www.twitch.tv/zer0cool0tv/clip/PricklyExcitedHabaneroFUNgineer

    https://www.twitch.tv/zer0cool0tv/clip/AlivePiercingCrowTTours

     

    Kindest Regards,

    A-02 | Jack Simmons

    Assistant Chief of Police

    New York Police Department

    Edited by Jack Simmons
    Added Clips
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    I thought this post is a 2 sided story? Yet its just about cops
    Maybe someone should do an identical post but about criminals vs cops lol

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    • *Management

    Okay /me Tries to cool the chat down. Hey guys FDNY hiring did you know? We are hiring yeah that’s right. We are hiring yeah every day yeah still hiring tho. (Spread legs I mean love not war). Again we hiring okay. 

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    1 hour ago, decadE said:

    I see a lot of comments about what's "realistic" but I think the best roleplay comes from ridiculous scenarios which occur in ways that could never be mimicked IRL. For example, I think the server could benefit massively by buffing the damage cars take before they're disabled. This would provide longer pursuits and open up the ability to do unique jumps or maneuvers. It's not realistic, but it's fun and I think that's what we're all here for anyways. GTA was never meant to be a realistic platform, but it's full of mechanics that add a ton of potential for interesting scenarios if we take advantage of them. 


    Just to clarify for anyone else that thinks something along these lines since it comes up in Twitch chat in various channels:

    This is a roleplay server using the GTA skeleton for the purpose of serious roleplay (serious from server description on fivem).
    Simply using GTA does not mean we should be hitting stunt jumps at high speeds since this conflicts with the roleplay rules of the server.


     

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    D.B Cooper really put into perspective, first week he was here he did some dumb stuff, he RDMd some dude after coming out of pillbox. He got reported and banned, what kind of ban did he get? A 24hr Ban? Nope. A 48hr Ban? Nope. He got a 7 day Ban for something people are getting warnings about now a days.


    I was banned for SIX MONTHS for something that people do all the time these days and I'd done all I could to try and make it a solid roleplay scenario that had a character arch lasting 3 months leading up to the event. I'm reassured their actions will be dealt with when I report similar scenarios to mine only to see them back within a week or two.
    I was told my previous ?? rule breaks lead up to this six month ban and haven't had any clarity on this.

    I'm starting to feel like a lack of roleplay and respect for the rules has lead to some cops feeling like they need to win in order to get some kind of sense of punishment for these people.
    I've even had cops tell me they've stopped reporting because nothing seems to happen.

    I'm not trying to put management in the firing line. I can imagine their role is pretty tough. However I think its important to look at how everyone within the community could be contributing to the negative experiences we encounter and the effects they have.

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    This post is an attempt to further segregate the community into 2 parts even further. This shouldn't be all about "COPS" and what we do. You forget this is a roleplay community. You forget that just normal civilians are out there? Not everyone has to be a shitlord criminal.  It's not about "cops vs robbers"  ITS ABOUT ROLEPLAYING IN A MANNER THAT IS FUN FOR EVERYONE!. This post is just sad. I only see an attempt to rally up the masses. I Don't think this post will do any good rather than ruffle some peoples feathers. 

    Edited by Sterling_live
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    Hmmm, I would expect this kind of post from a concerned criminal, but not from management that's trained not to pin players against each other.

    Why post these concerns here when you already know what's being discussed by the top admins? It sounds like you're just trying to start something and it's irresponsible of your role in the community, Poker.

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    Actually I disagree.  I think this post could be helpful.  Sure it says that PD is OP pretty much and do what it takes to win and we do he is not lieing about that just like  I can say the same for most crims I run into.    Tbh with you it sucks seeing a post like this because you want to see ppl respecting PD and what we do out there.  But no matter what it will forever be both sides trying to win in a situation thats what you do in a video game you win of course there is other ways to win as well such as having FUN.  Again as it has been said many times already this is supposed to be for fun.  I will be honest I dont not care rather I win or lose in any situation I am in.   I am able to continue a dream I had IRL when I was young being denied trying to join IRL PD or Marine corps that destroyed me but being able to do what I am doing right now it let me have that chance to see what its like to interact with ppl as a police officer.   Thats what BigcityRP being apart of PD has let me do and I have a hell of a lotta fun doing it.  Its not about winning or losing.  Winning to me is being able to deesculate a situation without the use of cuffs.  Winning to me is having a laugh with the suspect you are arresting.  If its not fun for you then you wont be making it fun for the person you are interacting with.    Thats how I see it.     

     

    Poker I believe this is MJ Gotti right??  Hella great RP with you everything in the city bro.  My man this post is looked at as saying PD is OP truth is we are.  So are crims though imo were balanced.  Dude crims have these no license plate cars crims have vehicles that goes 200mphs.  Were all here to have fun my dude 100% though I hope your post is looked at as critique and how we can improve as a department.  

    Edited by dNStreeeet
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    6 hours ago, Poker said:

    This is a two way street on both Cop and Crim gameplay.

     

     

     

    I am still confused what the goal of this discussion is. 

    My only input on this matter is - If you've only played crim, try cop. If you have only played cop, try crim. There some shitty stuff on cop, and some shitty stuff on crim. It's a video game and not everything is perfect. I don't have much time so I can't give my in-depth opinion on some of the things brought up in Pokers post, but I will say that it seems very biased. Most of the issues listed aren't even a SOP problem, it's someone not following SOPS and rules. Some of Pokers concerns I can agree with but the majority, not so much. I currently can't turn my thoughts to words at the moment or else I would explain more in depth, but I will leave my response at that. P.S - Please don't quote me asking for a rebuttal because I will not be posting again. 

     

    But like it started, I can agree it is in fact a two way street, but you only listed your lane. 

     

    EDIT: After thinking a bit more I also wanted to add that I feel like all of these things listed are the tools we use to stop crims. We talk about cop win mentality but you're suggesting we nerf all of the tools we use to stop criminals? Like your car that breaks the sound barrier within 2 city blocks isn't good enough? For the most part what I usually get most of the time on duty is... Tail lights 3 football fields away, a random person running into the middle of the street kicking my car screaming fuck 12, and bullets in my face. 

    Edited by Jax Hunt
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    To attempt to redirect this post back to what I suppose was it's original intention, here are a number of things that I think could be improved upon by the criminals and/or things that I see/hear them doing, not necessarily "wrong", but there are better options.

    1. This kind of falls in line of not just "criminals" but all "civilians".. is to value your life and your possessions more than you do right now. If we're going to take the overall picture and compare it to how things are in real life, you hit another vehicle head on, at 50-60 mph, almost guaranteed to have the vehicle deemed "a total loss" by any insurance company. Additionally, for the individuals who travel through the city at 100+ mph, that would also to an extent seem to fall under a "no value of life" rule, however us as management have not punished for that. Having spent time on duty as a police officer in the city, I have clocked people going as slow as 45 MPH, being the speed limit, to clocking people doing 180 MPH down Vespucci Boulevard.


    Just to provide a relatively real life example of a vehicle collision of the sort, described above: This Photo I would like to use, to sort of show how 'laxed we are when it comes to "injuries" inside the city. This was a single vehicle accident, where the vehicle was flipped I would say roughly 2-3 times, before coming to rest after uprooting a tree or two, before coming to rest, in that final location showed in the photo. The resulting injuries to the individual that was driving, was a fractured jaw, a fractured arm, 4 broken ribs, and a broken foot. He has spent roughly, now a week in the hospital attempting to recover from these injuries and was informed by doctors, that he has to consume liquid food for the next 5 weeks, at least. He can't articulate words very well, as his jaw was wired shut, to let the jaw heal.

     

    TL;DR of Point 1 : Try slowing down a little bit while traveling through the city.

     

    2. Gun Fights - (Not necessarily with law enforcement).. Continuing the "value of life", and where we as a city/server/community seem to lack on it at least in my opinion, is the constant partaking in shootouts between individuals. In real life, most groups/gangs will do what they can to avoid a shootout, as if you die.. your dead, there's no reviving back at the hospital, and continuing on your merry way 5 minutes later. I think perhaps, a potential solution to this would be to add a "punishment" for going to the hospital, doing this in regards to having it cost money as it would in real life to visit any hospital and/or emergency room. Like this man in Seattle who now faces a $1.1 million dollar hospital bill after recovering from Covid-19. Although, most of/maybe all of it will be covered from insurance, however, that is still a pretty steep bill to pay for anyone whether it be a single person or a group of tax payers.

    3. Interaction - Another topic that I think civilians/criminals could make improvement is their interaction with law enforcement. Like a few people mentioned above, as a cop in the city, we are met with a handful of things, one of them being is just simply bullets to the face, or some random guy running out into the middle of the street screaming fuck 12, etc.  In a number of situations involving police vs criminal(s), a good chunk of the police roleplay is, literally, just pursuing a fleeing vehicle. At the point in which the criminal gets caught, then they will usually end up being quiet the entirety of the time they are being processed, or they will respond to the cop with "i dont care just send me off". Add in a bit of explicit language, might dictate exactly what is said a bit better, but will keep it out of this post.

    3.1 - Interaction w/ All other departments - The biggest thing that I can stress about this roleplay we can provide to other people at the very least, is to be respectful to other people's jobs. Be patient with people, as with some of the jobs, EMS, Mechanic, Lawyer alike, is there are very few people that want to actually participate in the job, because of the poor roleplay comes out of it. I have heard many cases, and have witnessed very few of them, of people who will get picked up by EMS, to get ready to be transported to the hospital, and they just run off. Mechanics? If they go out to a tow call, not requested by PD, they end up getting interrogated as to why it took them so long to get out to them, and they're out in Sandy Shores doing whatever.. 

     

    I don't mind having good conversations like this for the community to comment, post and react, however, the conversation should not be a one sided argument about whether one party is OP or not. I would ask to try and keep comments to be constructive, and if there is anything to offer to the table, don't hesitate to do so.

     

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    • *Owner

    So some things you mentioned in this post we can all agree can be re-worked or changed.

     

    But unless your pablo escabar you will always be at somewhat of a disadvantage to police.

    Crims dont have helicopters, spike strips, radar, dogs or sniper rifles just to name a few, so yes you will be at a disadvantage vs a police department irl and in game.

     

    Can we get criminals to think before they do something? Maybe not using a personal car for illegal activity? Maybe plan something instead of just yolo'ing it, then cry when they get caught?

    I mean I always like to hear things we can change or fix by community members, but its more disturbing, your a part of staff and come here calling out one side.

    How can you remain fair as part of staff? Hard to see you will after this.

     

    Staff should always remain neutral, you have clearly showed here, you see things one sided. 

     

     

     

     

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    I would love to see the same thing but (CRIMS) would be cool to see how people see crims. Me myself am a crim and there are many things that really do need some big changes 

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    Allright, as a EX Crim, I would say stuff wasent hard for me, i got away whit most of the stuff, just by talking. talking gets you way further away than guns. and that leads to more problems, criminals have fast af cars, most of em are like tanks, they got the bois, and if something happens some random might join the criminals team too, as of from cops point of view its scary, and to be honest criminals have it more easier, especially the ones that dont care that much.  i agree whit crunches "unless your pablo escabar you will always be at somewhat of a disadvantage to police." But to be honest, i think the cops are in a disadvantage most of the time, especially when they pulling up to something and they got no idea what is gonna happen and when it comes to worst cases, people start shooting cops. cops get ready for this, and this gets criminals angry for it. But if the criminals now what they doing, most criminals forget that they are innocent until proven guilty.

    When i used to be a crim, i was basically riding a bmx, no gun. and robbed stores. 3/5 stores i wasent guilty for it. just by talking, thinking of excuses or just planning in advanse.
    If you got your back up story ready. you can get away whit almost everything, if you gotta kill a guy, and cops come. dont be like that Bitch ass started shooting at me and i defended my self. especially if you had a illegal gun, if you have a better story to talk about. they might not even realise you had a illegal gun, and you got multiple ways to distract or move cops going to that direction, all im saying if your prepared, in any other way than leading to a gun. your set. most of the time

    Cops got it really hard, let say you do something for the first time, and talk shit to a cop. and you defend yourself whit i never done it before, let say you got 50 crims in the city, 
    It might be the first for you in a long time, but trust me not the first for the cop. they see the same thing happening everyday. might be special for you. 
    So atleast try to make it special for the cop too. if your too scared to get in to prison. then dont do the crime, allways think that youll end up in prison for it. and then you realise you got more ways to get out of it. dont meant that throw your keys out of the windows and put your hands up. if its  a stolen car you can talk your way out of it, just dont say i borrowed it etc. 
    Crims got a big advantage. and some crims are ruining it for others, whit shooting for no reason, code 0ing that makes cops think that oh another stop. he gonna pull out and shoot. 

    Lemme take my gun out. not every criminal is a dickhead. but most of em are. and for that reason, most of the cops are ready for it.

    Information on criminal side is being ruined everytime, just because most of crims cant think before saying or getting money for something. this is a pretty one sided text, just because i didnt see any criminal talk in here. 
    But cops have it hard, criminals have it easy. 

    Most of the stuff from OP was nerfing cop stuff, but no one has talked about nerfing crims. 

     

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    Great discussion. I quit management today due to a completely unrelated topic. I plan on posting more topics for discussion as a community. Want to address Criminal Gameplay? Take the time to write it up, instead of complain about it verbally. There is plenty to write about of wrong doing. From metagaming, using discord, being disrespectful, shitlording, cheating, etc. to a long list of other things. The number 1 issue is they get kicked and banned for these reasons and many more while cops get protected under complaint procedure for most part. There is no consistent standard for the community as a whole is why I made this post. 

     

    Criminal Gameplay would be another great discussion to have as a community. 

     

    The views on this topic clearly shows it is a popular topic in this community. Most of the replies are from cops, because I have identified the main issues crims experience from cop gameplay.

     

    Anyway, hope everyone continues to have fun on BCRP and hope that collectively as a community we can improve the quality of RP gameplay here.

     

    Thanks,

    Poker

    Edited by Poker
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    15 hours ago, Crunch said:

    So some things you mentioned in this post we can all agree can be re-worked or changed.

     

    But unless your pablo escabar you will always be at somewhat of a disadvantage to police.

    Crims dont have helicopters, spike strips, radar, dogs or sniper rifles just to name a few, so yes you will be at a disadvantage vs a police department irl and in game.

     

    Can we get criminals to think before they do something? Maybe not using a personal car for illegal activity? Maybe plan something instead of just yolo'ing it, then cry when they get caught?

    I mean I always like to hear things we can change or fix by community members, but its more disturbing, your a part of staff and come here calling out one side.

    How can you remain fair as part of staff? Hard to see you will after this.

     

    Staff should always remain neutral, you have clearly showed here, you see things one sided. 

     

     

     

     

    Crunch, you say that I am biased and one sided? Absolutely not sir. Whats one sided is management being 95% law enforcement, 2% FDNY, and then 4 staff non criminals. So the perspective is unbalanced and biased whether you believe it or not. 

     

    Thanks,

    Poker

     

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    • *Management
    19 minutes ago, Jamie said:

    just because they have law enforcement or goverment official characters doesnt mean they dont have crims.

     

    If there is government officials players who dont have a crim thats a surprise but every cop or fdny or anyone who has responded to this has a criminal character or just a regular civilian and can see it from both sides of the book

    Agree. I’m a fdny member I do have a crime. 

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    I am just happy to be here.

    I love everyone I interact with especially you Mr. Gotti. 

    I know myself and my friends are not the win heavy cops. Us being cops is just trying to lead by example.

    (In most circumstances, I like to fuck around and have fun. Anyone who knows me in city, knows this.)

     

    -SGT Ricky Bobby

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    1 hour ago, Poker said:

    The number 1 issue is they get kicked and banned for these reasons and many more while cops get protected under complaint procedure for most part. There is no consistent standard for the community as a whole is why I made this post. 

    I don't believe this to be true, complaint procedure is for people to write a complaint against an officer when they believe they have violated S.O.P. Officers get banned all the time, including myself in the past. Officers aren't protected in anyway. Break a server rule and we should get banned like everyone, break S.O.P. and a complaint should be written, two totally different things

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    3 minutes ago, Jack Weasley said:

    Hey guys have you tried Butter pecan ice cream? It taste so damn good like Mmm. You let the ice cream melt a bit nice and runny but still icy but runny then scoop up with a tea spoon,,, oh baby baby goooodlord the pecan bite oh man. 
     

    just try out alright. 
     

    End this war 

    We are trying to have a conversation about a problem in the city. Can you please be more considerate rather then post these useless comments?

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    3 hours ago, Poker said:

    Great discussion. I quit management today due to a completely unrelated topic. I plan on posting more topics for discussion as a community. Want to address Criminal Gameplay? Take the time to write it up, instead of complain about it verbally. There is plenty to write about of wrong doing. From metagaming, using discord, being disrespectful, shitlording, cheating, etc. to a long list of other things. The number 1 issue is they get kicked and banned for these reasons and many more while cops get protected under complaint procedure for most part. There is no consistent standard for the community as a whole is why I made this post. 

     

    Criminal Gameplay would be another great discussion to have as a community. 

     

    The views on this topic clearly shows it is a popular topic in this community. Most of the replies are from cops, because I have identified the main issues crims experience from cop gameplay.

     

    Anyway, hope everyone continues to have fun on BCRP and hope that collectively as a community we can improve the quality of RP gameplay here.

     

    Thanks,

    Poker

    This is what I'm still having an issue with. YOU make the topic Cops vs Crims Roleplay and then make these opinionated comments about the cop side but nothing about the crim side.  Again YOU made this post we shouldnt have to write up all the things that is wrong (in our opinions) with crim rp that should've been stated in the original post which was made by again YOU.  Which makes this again one sided enough said. Next time for the love of god if you post a topic concerning both sides of the community then make statements for both sides not just one. I'm done posting on this now. Thank you for coming to my Ted talk

    Edited by Chris Strain
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    Crims: 

    Gunplay over roleplay

    Friends randomly showing up to free their buddy from cuffs (so much magic!)

    Fleeing on simple traffic stops

    Deliberately driving fastest cars so they don't get caught

    Not wanting to spend time roleplaying after getting caught

    Specifically targeting female cops in terms of harassment

     

    Cops:

    Rarely showing lenience 

    Powertrips/powerplays

    Not prioritizing lives over the chase of a criminal

    Unprofessionalism

    Breaking IC law to avoid RP

    Bias/favoritism within departments not leading to repercussions of SOP violations

     

    Both:

    Not always remaining IC (too much OOC shit)

    Not valuing life (themselves and others)

    Not respecting each other

    Not following realistic roleplay

     

    Solutions-

    Crims:

    Staff need to be stricter on punishment of anyone who is just here to play GTA Online, or don't have RP in mind in their choices. Rule-breaks or otherwise, a standard needs to be upheld, and if it's not enforced then nothing will change.

     

    Cops: 

    Superiors in PD need to be stricter than they are, and to enforce stricter training for those who join. If a superior cannot behave or look at the complaints with a neutral, unbiased approach, then they should not be in the position to provide input.

     

    Edited by Zelda
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